UG Midrange

[HedgehogPie]

I started playing highlander about week or two backwards and now it's pretty much the time to improve my list:

Lands [39]
13xIsland
11xForest
Simic gowth chamber
Okina, temple to the grandfathers
Tree of tales
Pendelhaven
Centaur garden
Tranquil thicket
Lonely sandbar
Faerie conclaive
Minamo, school at water's edge
Urza's factory
Novijen, heart of progress
Ghost quarter
Boseiju, who shelters all
Desert
Terramorphic expanse

Creatures [35]
Fyndhorn elves
Cloud sprite
Curse catcher
Plaxmanta
Coiling oracle
Wild mongrel
Looter il-kor
River boa
Scryb ranger
Spiketail hatchling
Mire boa
Spiketail drakeling
Ophidian
Trygon predator
Yavimaya dryad
Yavimaya elder
Cloud spirit
Troll ascetic
Loaming shaman
Man-o'-War
Patagia viper
Assault zeppelid
Wickerbought elder
Solemn simulacrum
Wonder
Ninja of deep hours
Thieving magpie
Mystic snake
Indrik stomphowler
Genesis
Mulldrifter
Riftwing cloudskate
Murkfien liege
Arashi, the sky asunder
Kodama of the north tree

Instant [12]
Spell burst
Repeal
Unsummon
Boomerang
Counterspell
Hinder
Cancel
Voidslime
Oona's grace
Ether well
Ensnare
Gush

Sorcery [4]
Recollect
Combpulsive research
Tidings
Bribery

Enchantment [9]
Earthcraft
Counterbalance
Squirrel nest
Moldervine cloak
Abundance
Mystic restraints
Honden of seeing winds
Honden of life's web
Fable of wolf and owl

Artifact [1]
Sensei's divining top

----------

Cards going out next:
Mystic restraints
Ensnare
Spel burst

The deck mainly plays turns 1-4 aggroing and from that on spitting huge loads of meat into the board.

My main problem is against faster aggros. Especially RB goblins. I get to play my first anything when they've rolled all over me turns ago(I should never had traded moggcatcher to him...). What would be something that slows these buggers down enough to put some meat into the table. I have won about 2/6 games and each time he had slow start so I got my horde ready first.

Second is against the less budgetized rock. Even earthcraft+Squirrel nest-combo couldn't stop it. He just tutored up pernicious deed(or something like that) and destroyed everything I had. Stats against him are 0-4

Other meta:
RBG Mana ramplike dragons
BUw Artifact
UW control
UW skies

I'd like to have comments on the deck. Ways to improve it and so...

Thanks in advance!

[VuRkka]

I'd look into less mana intensive counters; Daze, FoW, Spell Snare, Miscalculation and such.

Trinket Mage offers a fine toolbox in form of Tormod's Crypt, Pithing Needle and Engineered Explosives, which helps against Deeds, opposing weenis and Loams, it also helps you to find SDT.

[Mythrandir]

i think you run some sub-optimal cards, but i believe u dont want to make this a very expensive (â,¬â,¬â,¬) deck, is this right? however i´ll give u all the expensive ones + not-so-expensives ones

some cards to cut:

- minamo school at water edge
- novijen
- cloud spirit
- assault zeppelid
- wickerbough elder
- indrik stomphowler
- murkfin liege
- arashi
- ether well
- ensnare
- recolect
-abundance (unless you wanna combo with this)
- 2x honden
- fable
- bribery

Cards to add/consider:
- tropical island
- breeding pool
- yavimaya coast
- fetchs for U/G
- Gifts ungiven
- intuition
- deep analysis
- impulse/brainstorm/ponder (-> these work well with counterbalance)
- trinket mage
- eternal witness
- regrowth
- mana drain
- force of will
- remand
- dissipate
- forbid (better than a simple cancel)
- fact or fiction
- wasteland
- cold eye silkie (since u have loads of damage -> draw)
- ohran viper
- daze
- tormod crypt/ phyrexian furnace /scrabbling claws
- krosan grip
- viridian zealot
- tarmogoyf
- back to basics (how it hurts me to write this one.. )

if u want a fattie, i´d suggest Simic sky swallower

Also there is a list here of a UG skies, u might wanna check it too for some ideas.

This was just a quick review/suggestion. Your deck has lots of spaceto improve yet.

[HedgehogPie]

I'd look into less mana intensive counters; Daze, FoW, Spell Snare, Miscalculation and such.

Only problem with those is the all mighty FoW. It costs too much atleast for my current situation. Miscalculations I seem to already have in some box... I got to figure what to remove for it. I ould try to get those other spells...

Trinket Mage offers a fine toolbox in form of Tormod's Crypt, Pithing Needle and Engineered Explosives, which helps against Deeds, opposing weenis and Loams, it also helps you to find SDT.

Heard about trinket mage today. I'm going to get one into the list as soon as possible.

i think you run some sub-optimal cards, but i believe u dont want to make this a very expensive (â,¬â,¬â,¬) deck, is this right? however i´ll give u all the expensive ones + not-so-expensives ones

Actually I'm quitting playing T2 for its constant "buy buy buy more!!!" attitude and focusing more on highlander. So I'm pretty much trying to maximize my deck... Ofcourse getting tose really, really expensive cards is hard...

some cards to cut:

- minamo school at water edge
- novijen
- cloud spirit
- assault zeppelid
- wickerbough elder
- indrik stomphowler
- murkfin liege
- arashi
- ether well
- ensnare
- recolect
-abundance (unless you wanna combo with this)
- 2x honden
- fable
- bribery

Most of the cards are there for filling up empty space...

Few notes:

-I personally like arashi for being the only removal against the all mighty dragons but maybe I don't need any.
-Abundance I like. It aids drawing something else than mere lands... Its cuttable but not the first in line.
-Also Fable is one winning card for this deck(Note: without anything else ultimate). Swarming tokens is fun but it just comes a bit too late.
-Indrik and especially the elder have shown great succes. I wont cut them soon.

Cards to add/consider:
- tropical island
- breeding pool
- yavimaya coast
- fetchs for U/G
- Gifts ungiven
- intuition
- deep analysis
- impulse/brainstorm/ponder (-> these work well with counterbalance)
- trinket mage
- eternal witness
- regrowth
- mana drain
- force of will
- remand
- dissipate
- forbid (better than a simple cancel)
- fact or fiction
- wasteland
- cold eye silkie (since u have loads of damage -> draw)
- ohran viper
- daze
- tormod crypt/ phyrexian furnace /scrabbling claws
- krosan grip
- viridian zealot
- tarmogoyf
- back to basics (how it hurts me to write this one.. )

My... There's a whole lot of cards I never knew of. Hunting the most expensive lands will have to be postponed(or someone must be drunk...).
I don't know about krosan grip. Is it that good?

I'm starting to hunt most of those as soon as possible.

if u want a fattie, i´d suggest Simic sky swallower

Also there is a list here of a UG skies, u might wanna check it too for some ideas.

This was just a quick review/suggestion. Your deck has lots of spaceto improve yet.

SSS is already in my list to get. I'm just glad someone mentioned it since I was not sure wether its the best choice.

I checked and even commented the list. I got some ideas from it but I like big critters(4/4+) more than small evasive ones. Bt maybe it's the better way to go... I don't know until tried hmm..?

Just bring it on. All comments are more than welcome. I also would like to get some explanations on why to do something.

PS: I'd like to know the viability of:
-Meloku, clouded mirror
-Weatherseed treefolk
-Ravenous baloth
-Phantom centaur
...in highlander

[VuRkka]

I don't know about krosan grip. Is it that good?

It is that good, there's always something you want to get rid of. And with Krosan Grip you don't have to counterwar to remove it.

I got some ideas from it but I like big critters(4/4+) more than small evasive ones. Bt maybe it's the better way to go... I don't know until tried hmm..?

Just bring it on. All comments are more than welcome. I also would like to get some explanations on why to do something.

PS: I'd like to know the viability of:
-Meloku, clouded mirror
-Weatherseed treefolk
-Ravenous baloth
-Phantom centaur
...in highlander

There are some great small costed creatures with decent bodies, like Nimble Mongoose, Werewolf and Seton Scout(for the UW Skies you have in your meta). Not forgetting Tarmogoyf too. In order to run these kind of critters you'd need to run cantrips and fetches to reach Threshold quickly.

Ravenous Baloth has a great manacost/power ratio and you can sac it to gain life, helps against aggro. But it's more usable if you have a way to recur it.

Meloku is rather slow, you can win with it, but it wont help you much if you're already losing.

[HedgehogPie]

I don't know about krosan grip. Is it that good?

It is that good, there's always something you want to get rid of. And with Krosan Grip you don't have to counterwar to remove it.

I got some ideas from it but I like big critters(4/4+) more than small evasive ones. Bt maybe it's the better way to go... I don't know until tried hmm..?

Just bring it on. All comments are more than welcome. I also would like to get some explanations on why to do something.

PS: I'd like to know the viability of:
-Meloku, clouded mirror
-Weatherseed treefolk
-Ravenous baloth
-Phantom centaur
...in highlander

There are some great small costed creatures with decent bodies, like Nimble Mongoose, Werewolf and Seton Scout(for the UW Skies you have in your meta). Not forgetting Tarmogoyf too. In order to run these kind of critters you'd need to run cantrips and fetches to reach Threshold quickly.

Ravenous Baloth has a great manacost/power ratio and you can sac it to gain life, helps against aggro. But it's more usable if you have a way to recur it.

Meloku is rather slow, you can win with it, but it wont help you much if you're already losing.

Well... I'm glad I have a copy. I'll put the grip in swiftly...

Well. For baloth recurring there is genesis. I think that's atleast something. Now if I could just get those "tutor a huge ammount of cards to get couple in your hand and rest into grave"-cards. I guess that survival should be included. I wonder just where to get one now...

[Mythrandir]

Now if I could just get those "tutor a huge ammount of cards to get couple in your hand and rest into grave"-cards. I guess that survival should be included.

well, there is always life from the loam, gifts ungiven and intuition (best tutors around).

[HedgehogPie]

well, there is always life from the loam, gifts ungiven and intuition (best tutors around).

I'll try to get hold of atleast of the two latter ones.

I just got some new cards in my hand and found something in my closet too. I could use some help in making the cuts and adds.
Cards I'm most likely putting in(as suggested):
-Deep analysis
-Remand
-Trinket mage
-Miscalculation
-Tormod's crypt
-Krosan grip

Cards Im highly thinking about:
-Memory lapse. Seems an evil counter to me.
-Weatherseed treefolk. Its 5cc 5/3 that comes back and again...
-Spellstutter sprite. More lil' fliers and with countering action.

Possibly might work:
-Ponder. Not brainstorm, but might almost do the thing.
-Jhessian infiltrator. Unblockable 2/1... not bad.
-Selkie hedge-mage. Seems nice since I will have loads of basics.
-Dryad sophisticate. More unblockable.
-Iwamori of the open fist. More bigger men. The drawback worries me and at the time doesn't...
-Muddle the mixture. Tutors for earthcraft and semicounterspell.
-Llanowar elves. I have fynhorn already. Either this in or cut him too.

The ones i'm thinking of cutting first myself(as stated in my first post):
Spell burst
Ether well
Ensnare

What do you think?

[Mythrandir]

Possibly might work:
-Ponder. Not brainstorm, but might almost do the thing.

Well, brainstorm is way better IMO. Instant speed is very important.


The ones i'm thinking of cutting first myself(as stated in my first post):
Spell burst
Ether well
Ensnare

What do you think?
[/quote]

some cards to cut:

- minamo school at water edge
- novijen
- cloud spirit
- assault zeppelid
- wickerbough elder
- indrik stomphowler
- murkfin liege
- arashi
- ether well
- ensnare
- recolect
-abundance (unless you wanna combo with this)
- 2x honden
- fable
- bribery

i´ve already given u quite a few card for you to cut
Like i said, you play some sub-optimal cards.

After testing, please put here the results. thks

[HedgehogPie]

Changes:

-Minamo, school at the water's edge
-Assault zeppelid
-Mystic restraints
-Recollect
-Fyndhorn elves
-Venser's diffusion
-Yavimaya dryad
-Indrik stomphowler
-Ensnare
-Cloud sprite
-Bribery
-Ether well

+Tormod's crypt
+Memory lapse
+Weatherseed treefolk
+Iwamori of the open fist
+Selkie hedge-mage
+Muddle the mixture
+Spellstutter sprite
+Remand
+Deep analysis
+Trinket mage
+Krosan grip
+Silhana ledgewalker

I'll post an updated list later.

Testing results:

Somekind of BRG Big mana with loads of dragons
-Game1 I started with bad hand and he just got more and more mana in few turns and played dragon storm for that GBR dragon from alara... Good game.
-Game 2 I got a godhand turn 1 cursecatcher, 2 earthcraft, 3 squirrelnest... Scoop.
-Game 3 I got turn 1 top and dropped some smaller men into the field. He pyroclasmed(couple times) the table and after that form of a dragon(or something like that). I played weatherseed treefolk and krosangripped him on my turn.
2-1

BR goblins
-Game 1. I started nice turn 1 top, turn 2 counterbalance and only thing he got through was siege-gang commander wich got bigger men in front of him. Victory.
-Game 2. He started to infest the board with small goblins. I got my men into play and he kept on blocking me with everything he had while killing me with something with fear.
-Game 3. he burnt down all of my creatures and beat me down with the goblin(blossomish form alara) enchantment.
1-2

Some artifact thing...
-Game 1. Nice hand 3xIsland, cursecatcher, spiketail hatchling & drakeling and spellstutter sprite. I started to drop men and he swore even more than me... And that's a lot I tell you.(I'm glad he did'nt realize that everything he could have played would have been removal...). Turn 6 kodama of the north tree and he gave up saying my deck is broken(yeah right).
-Game 2. He played some weird artifacts that bring back other artifacts from grave... He just didn't have anything there. I countered something and played fable wich he called the crappiest crap ever. After playing Coiling oracle and few counterspells and getting few tokens he yelled it was broken... Victory again.
2-0

UW control.
-Game 1. I dropped few lands and
-Game 2. I went on with small men dropping his life total to 4. Then he got invincible hymn with boseiju. Yay! I continued the next turns dropping both hondens countertop and fable and broke his boseiju with ghost quarters. He tried to O-ring counterbalance without success and then he played ghostly prison. I got slowed down too much and he played meloku wich I got rid of with Arashi's channel. Then I drawed krosan grip and ran over him during the same turn.

The last game got krosan grip shining in my eye... I never got some card in my hand but the testing goes on...

Goblins are still hard(mostly the darn fear men).

[Mythrandir]

Changes:

-Minamo, school at the water's edge
-Assault zeppelid
-Mystic restraints
-Recollect
-Fyndhorn elves
-Venser's diffusion
-Yavimaya dryad
-Indrik stomphowler
-Ensnare
-Cloud sprite
-Bribery
-Ether well

+Tormod's crypt
+Memory lapse
+Weatherseed treefolk
+Iwamori of the open fist
+Selkie hedge-mage
+Muddle the mixture
+Spellstutter sprite
+Remand
+Deep analysis
+Trinket mage
+Krosan grip
+Silhana ledgewalker

I'll post an updated list later.

Testing results:

Somekind of BRG Big mana with loads of dragons
-Game1 I started with bad hand and he just got more and more mana in few turns and played dragon storm for that GBR dragon from alara... Good game.
-Game 2 I got a godhand turn 1 cursecatcher, 2 earthcraft, 3 squirrelnest... Scoop.
-Game 3 I got turn 1 top and dropped some smaller men into the field. He pyroclasmed(couple times) the table and after that form of a dragon(or something like that). I played weatherseed treefolk and krosangripped him on my turn.
2-1

BR goblins
-Game 1. I started nice turn 1 top, turn 2 counterbalance and only thing he got through was siege-gang commander wich got bigger men in front of him. Victory.
-Game 2. He started to infest the board with small goblins. I got my men into play and he kept on blocking me with everything he had while killing me with something with fear.
-Game 3. he burnt down all of my creatures and beat me down with the goblin(blossomish form alara) enchantment.
1-2

Some artifact thing...
-Game 1. Nice hand 3xIsland, cursecatcher, spiketail hatchling & drakeling and spellstutter sprite. I started to drop men and he swore even more than me... And that's a lot I tell you.(I'm glad he did'nt realize that everything he could have played would have been removal...). Turn 6 kodama of the north tree and he gave up saying my deck is broken(yeah right).
-Game 2. He played some weird artifacts that bring back other artifacts from grave... He just didn't have anything there. I countered something and played fable wich he called the crappiest crap ever. After playing Coiling oracle and few counterspells and getting few tokens he yelled it was broken... Victory again.
2-0

UW control.
-Game 1. I dropped few lands and
-Game 2. I went on with small men dropping his life total to 4. Then he got invincible hymn with boseiju. Yay! I continued the next turns dropping both hondens countertop and fable and broke his boseiju with ghost quarters. He tried to O-ring counterbalance without success and then he played ghostly prison. I got slowed down too much and he played meloku wich I got rid of with Arashi's channel. Then I drawed krosan grip and ran over him during the same turn.

The last game got krosan grip shining in my eye... I never got some card in my hand but the testing goes on...

Goblins are still hard(mostly the darn fear men).

By the look of its, and dont take this the wrong way, your meta is a bit casual. you probably dont have lots of players using "highlander's archtype decks" do you? From what i see the deck pool is very casual (and again this isn bad ) so probably some of the cuts/adds we said aren´t ajusted to your meta, however i think you should try them anyway.

And keep reporting changes and testing

Btw, having problems with goblins? try ravenous baloth + garruk (nice combo) or wall of blossoms, wall of roots, spike feeder, spike weaver.

[HedgehogPie]

After testing for a while I've noticed that the bigger men won't come when they should and even they would come... They just get killed. The smaller guys with evasion has been overdoing it so I just decided to focus on them. So here's the new version:

Lands[30]
14xIsland
10xForest
Tranquil thicket
Tree of tales
Seat of synod
Pendelhaven
Lonely sandbar
Faerie conclaive

Creatures[27]
Scryb sprite
Cloudsprite
Xantid swarm
Flying men
Treetop scout
Skarrgan pit-skulk
Gilded drake
Mire boa
Dryad sophisticate
Cloud of sprites
Jhessian infiltrator
Looter il-kor
Scryb ranger
Spiketail hatchling
Plaxmanta
Surveiling sprite
Silhana ledgewalker
River boa
Sea sprite
Spellstutter sprite
Cloud spirit
Trinket mage
Rishadan airship
Vendilion clique
Trygon predator
Man-O'-War
Cold-eyed selkie
Mystic snake
Genesis

Instant[25]
Brainstorm
Annul
Spell snare
Force spike
Impulse
Boomerang
Echoing truth
Trickbind
Daze
Interdict
Mana leak
Miscalculation
Remand
Memory lapse
Counterspell
Voidslime
Cancel
Hinder
Rushing river
Krosan grip
Prionic blast
Foil
Rewind
Gush
Misdirection

Sorcery[1]
Ponder

Enchantment[7]
Rancor
Sylvan library
Standstill
Seal of primordium
Moldervine cloak
Counterbalance
Back to basics

Artifact [9]
Shuko
Sensei's divining top
Relic of progenitus
Black vise
Bone splitter
Winter orb
Mask of memory
Empyrial plate
Lightning greaves
Grafted wargear

I'm still missing the more expensive cards but that just can't be helped... What do you think?

[Mythrandir]

After testing for a while I've noticed that the bigger men won't come when they should and even they would come... They just get killed. The smaller guys with evasion has been overdoing it so I just decided to focus on them. So here's the new version:

Lands[30]
14xIsland
10xForest
Tranquil thicket
Tree of tales
Seat of synod
Pendelhaven
Lonely sandbar
Faerie conclaive

Creatures[27]
Scryb sprite
Cloudsprite
Xantid swarm
Flying men
Treetop scout
Skarrgan pit-skulk
Gilded drake
Mire boa
Dryad sophisticate
Cloud of sprites
Jhessian infiltrator
Looter il-kor
Scryb ranger
Spiketail hatchling
Plaxmanta
Surveiling sprite
Silhana ledgewalker
River boa
Sea sprite
Spellstutter sprite
Cloud spirit
Trinket mage
Rishadan airship
Vendilion clique
Trygon predator
Man-O'-War
Cold-eyed selkie
Mystic snake
Genesis

Instant[25]
Brainstorm
Annul
Spell snare
Force spike
Impulse
Boomerang
Echoing truth
Trickbind
Daze
Interdict
Mana leak
Miscalculation
Remand
Memory lapse
Counterspell
Voidslime
Cancel
Hinder
Rushing river
Krosan grip
Prionic blast
Foil
Rewind
Gush
Misdirection

Sorcery[1]
Ponder

Enchantment[7]
Rancor
Sylvan library
Standstill
Seal of primordium
Moldervine cloak
Counterbalance
Back to basics

Artifact [9]
Shuko
Sensei's divining top
Relic of progenitus
Black vise
Bone splitter
Winter orb
Mask of memory
Empyrial plate
Lightning greaves
Grafted wargear

I'm still missing the more expensive cards but that just can't be helped... What do you think?

It looks a bit like an Ug skies. here´s thibir Ug skies list  -> http://www.magicplayer.org/forum/index.php?topic=131.0 take a look it might give you another view on ug deck


Looks a lot better,than your previous list. how´s it fairing against other decks?

[HedgehogPie]

Yeah. It's pretty much skies... It also has done really well. Next thing will be updating the manabase to more consistent one.

Vs. Rock
It's been evil to play him. Hard rushing towards wins games. I added some counterspells just for this one. Especially when he "comboes" genesis+spike weaver it's just pain to get thru. Stealing his kokusho is fun tough. BtB and winter orb screws him nicely. Also mire boa is the best card for the matchup =)
1-2

Vs. Goblins
Speed vs. speed... It seems that it has been mostly matter of luck that I've won. Bounching is effective way to gain advantage. Black vise doesn't do anything :/
3-2

Vs. 5c control
First time against it. Turn 1 xantid swarm rules the matchup. Really it's good to cast spells without getting countered. BtB really destroys the deck atonce(he had about 3-5 basics) after many turns of beating from swarm equipped with shuko.
1-0

[Mythrandir]

Vs. 5c control
First time against it. Turn 1 xantid swarm rules the matchup. Really it's good to cast spells without getting countered. BtB really destroys the deck atonce(he had about 3-5 basics) after many turns of beating from swarm equipped with shuko.
1-0

Poor 5CC...