GB Rock

[nmlss]

Hi all,

I need help with my deck. I´m looking for any suggestions but don´t want to add another color. After banning survival, it´s not strong enough.

// Lands 36
   9 [UNH] Forest
   9 [UNH] Swamp
   1 [ON] Wooded Foothills
   1 [TE] Wasteland
   1 [ZEN] Verdant Catacombs
   1 [UL] Treetop Village
   1 [ON] Tranquil Thicket
   1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (1)
   1 [AL] Thawing Glaciers
   1 [AP] Llanowar Wastes
   1 [OD] Cabal Pit
   1 [WWK] Bojuka Bog
   1 [ON] Bloodstained Mire
   1 [DS] Blinkmoth Nexus
   1 [ON] Barren Moor
   1 [RAV] Overgrown Tomb
   1 [SOK] Miren, the Moaning Well
   1 [TSB] Pendelhaven
   1 [UD] Yavimaya Hollow
   1 [SH] Volrath's Stronghold

// Creatures
   1 [MR] Solemn Simulacrum
   1 [MR] Duplicant
   1 [ON] Ravenous Baloth
   1 [A] Birds of Paradise
   1 [ON] Krosan Tusker
   1 [DIS] Loaming Shaman
   1 [LRW] Shriekmaw
   1 [IA] Fyndhorn Elves
   1 Llanowar Elves
   1 [DK] Elves of Deep Shadow
   1 [EX] Wood Elves
   1 [M10] Elvish Visionary
   1 [RAV] Civic Wayfinder
   1 [SHM] Murderous Redcap
   1 [UD] Yavimaya Elder
   1 [CFX] Noble Hierarch
   1 [M10] Borderland Ranger
   1 [FD] Eternal Witness
   1 [JU] Genesis
   1 [LE] Bane of the Living
   1 [LE] Nantuko Vigilante
   1 [UL] Bone Shredder
   1 [SHM] Kitchen Finks
   1 [SH] Wall of Blossoms
   1 [MI] Wall of Roots
   1 [MOR] Chameleon Colossus
   1 [CHK] Sakura-Tribe Elder
   1 [EX] Spike Weaver
   1 [SH] Spike Feeder
   1 [LE] Seedborn Muse
   1 [EVE] Wickerbough Elder
   1 [MR] Troll Ascetic
   1 [LE] Graveborn Muse
   1 [CHK] Kokusho, the Evening Star

// Spells
   1 [R] Winter Orb
   1 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
   1 [DS] Sword of Fire and Ice
   1 [LG] Sylvan Library
   1 [AP] Pernicious Deed
   1 [EX] Recurring Nightmare
   1 [AP] Phyrexian Arena
   1 [A] Animate Dead
   1 [ROE] Realms Uncharted
   1 [RAV] Darkblast
   1 [TSP] Krosan Grip
   1 [TE] Diabolic Edict
   1 [RAV] Shred Memory
   1 [RAV] Putrefy
   1 [MI] Worldly Tutor
   1 [LRW] Garruk Wildspeaker
   1 [ARB] Maelstrom Pulse
   1 [LRW] Thoughtseize
   1 [10E] Sylvan Scrying
   1 [LRW] Profane Command
   1 [EVE] Raven's Crime
   1 [LRW] Primal Command
   1 [PLC] Damnation
   1 [TE] Living Death
   1 Demonic Tutor
   1 [M10] Duress
   1 [RAV] Life from the Loam
   1 [TO] Chainer's Edict
   1 [FE] Hymn to Tourach (4)
   1 [MOR] Bitterblossom

[Tiggupiru]

This deck looks like it doesn't know what it wants to accomplish. The tendency seems to be towards more control, but without survival to find the most effective solution and eventually win by card advantage, the deck falls apart. You need to replace those narrow cards that were only good with survival with bombs that the opponent has to deal with or more effective beaters. Right now, you have ways to generate card advantage, but you lack of pressure gives control time to get their own (and usually way better) card drawing spells to work for them.

I would take these cards out:

- Duplicant (six mana removal in a black deck is not very good, even with survival)
- Wood Elves (unless you can somehow recur 1/1's or they have some exceptional ability, like mother of runes, you don't want to play them)
- Elvish Visionary (This is debatable, but you probably want to have bigger and badder creatures)
- Murderous Redcap (Rarely has targets you need to get rid of)
- Bone Shredder (Good with survival, bad without)
- Spike Weaver (See above)
- Seedborn Muse (you need more instants to make use of this ability)
- Kokusho (Sure, it looks like that bomb I wanted you to have, but this is just bad against control. Blue decks have bounce/control magic and rest have removal that bypasses the trigger, like swords to plowshares. Not that great against aggro either, as you sometimes just want it to die in combat rather than just kill an attacker)


Then you need to figure out what strategy you want to go towards to. Aggro or control.

These I would take out, if you try to gear this deck towards control:

- Loaming Shaman
- Winter Orb
- Bitterblossom (Once you have time to get this work it's magic against fast aggro, you are just going to die to it. It's not bad against control though, so you might want to keep this, if aggro is not a problem)

Towards aggro:

- Bane of the Living
- Damnation
- Sylvan Scrying
- Realms Uncharted
- Genesis (I personally might take this out anyway, but with the control version you might end up having enough ways to get rid of this without the Survival)
- Spike Feeder


Despite the direction you want this deck to take, I would add these:

- Phyrexian Rager
- Inquisition of Kozilek
- Hypnotic Specter
- Dust Bowl

For the control approach, you need a clear theme and those afrorementioned bombs. I would imagine something like Death Cloud being one of them. You probably want to play more tutors as well, I'd suggest Rhystic Tutor and maybe Beseech the Queen. Diabolic Tutor is also a possibility, but I would not try to test it immediately. Harmonize, Night's Whisper and Sign in Blood would fit the theme quite well. Some acceleartion in form of Golgari Signet, Three Visits and Nature's Lore should probably be in there. I'd also try Drana.

Aggro wants to play more of those effective creatures, like Putrid Leech, Great Sable Stag, Blastoderm, Phantom Centaur, Call of the Herd, beastbreaker of bala ged... etc.
Some other nice aggro cards include, Rancor, Slaughter Pact (not bad in control either), Grim Discovery, Reanimate, Sword of Light and Shadow... etc.


Making a hybrid is something I'd avoid doing immediatly, aggrocontrol is very much of a possibility, but most of the cards work well in only one of the archetypes, so I would test both ends of the spectrum before trying something in between.

[nmlss]

Thank you for your advices. I was trying to make a rock like build with aggro taste. But there are still cards, which are discussable, like Elves of Deep Shadow, Worldly Tutor, Genesis, Kokusho or Tombstalker. I´m still looking forward for any advices. Especialy about bombs to finish opponent. I was thinking also about Ob Nixilis, the Fallen or Rampaging Baloths (also good with Ravenous Baloth), Overrun, Saproling Burst.... Remember pls, it´s budget deck, that´s why I don´t play Tarmogoyf, Bayou, etc.. This is my latest build, I was playing it for a week and I think it´s much more competitive nowdays (red color means added card):

// Lands
   1 [ON] Barren Moor
   8 [UNH] Forest
   1 [RAV] Overgrown Tomb
   1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (1)
   1 [SOK] Miren, the Moaning Well
   1 [AP] Llanowar Wastes
   1 [RAV] Golgari Rot Farm
   1 [ZEN] Plains (2a)
   1 [MM] Dust Bowl
   1 [OD] Cabal Pit
   1 [WWK] Bojuka Bog
   1 [ON] Bloodstained Mire
   1 [DS] Blinkmoth Nexus
   1 [SH] Volrath's Stronghold
   1 [UD] Yavimaya Hollow
   1 [ON] Wooded Foothills
   1 [TE] Wasteland
   8 [UNH] Swamp
   1 [ZEN] Verdant Catacombs
   1 [PLC] Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
   1 [UL] Treetop Village
   1 [ON] Tranquil Thicket
   1 [AL] Thawing Glaciers

// Creatures
   1 [CFX] Noble Hierarch
   1 [A] Birds of Paradise
   1 [SH] Wall of Blossoms
   1 [MI] Wall of Roots
   1 [ALA] Elvish Visionary
   1 [CHK] Sakura-Tribe Elder
   1 [IA] Fyndhorn Elves
   1 [DK] Elves of Deep Shadow
   1 [UL] Bone Shredder                   - can´t get rid of it
   1 Llanowar Elves
   1 [JU] Phantom Centaur
   1 [CHK] Nezumi Graverobber
   1 [FD] Eternal Witness
   1 [UD] Yavimaya Elder
  1 [A] Hypnotic Specter
   1 [MR] Solemn Simulacrum
   1 [M10] Borderland Ranger
   1 [RAV] Civic Wayfinder
   1 [VI] Uktabi Orangutan
   1 [ZEN] Vampire Nighthawk
   1 [MR] Troll Ascetic
   1 [LRW] Shriekmaw
   1 [LE] Nantuko Vigilante
   1 [DIS] Loaming Shaman
   1 [SHM] Kitchen Finks
   1 [LE] Graveborn Muse
   1 [LE] Bane of the Living         - same problem as bone shredder.
   1 [MOR] Chameleon Colossus
   1 [EVE] Wickerbough Elder
   1 [JU] Genesis                    - i think, that this is very usefull tool in late game.
   1 [ON] Ravenous Baloth
   1 [CHK] Kokusho, the Evening Star - can´t find better bomb into this deck.
   1 [FUT] Tombstalker
   1 [ON] Krosan Tusker
  1 [PLC] Darkheart Sliver

// Spells
   1 [TO] Chainer's Edict
   1 [ARB] Maelstrom Pulse
   1 [TE] Living Death
   1 [RAV] Life from the Loam
   1 [TSP] Krosan Grip
   1 [ROE] Inquisition of Kozilek
   1 [AP] Pernicious Deed
   1 [FE] Hymn to Tourach
   1 [M10] Duress
   1 [TE] Diabolic Edict
   1 Demonic Tutor
   1 [RAV] Darkblast
   1 [UL] Crop Rotation
   1 [RAV] Shred Memory
   1 [LG] Sylvan Library
   1 [MI] Worldly Tutor
   1 [LRW] Thoughtseize
   1 [DS] Sword of Light and Shadow
   1 [DS] Sword of Fire and Ice
   1 [AP] Phyrexian Arena
   1 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
   1 [EX] Recurring Nightmare
   1 [EVE] Raven's Crime
   1 [RAV] Putrefy
   1 [LRW] Primal Command
   1 [DIS] Crime/Punishment - this card is need, realy powerfull (i like also transmute-ing for it)
   1 [MOR] Bitterblossom
   1 [LRW] Garruk Wildspeaker

[Fish]

I had a lot of written down here but it was deleted because of time out so I am going to write it brief now.

My experience is: BG version of aggro will never be as aggresive as RG version and will never be as "unpleasnt" as GW version. I tried to build BG istead of RG but it wasn't enough. My brother played GBW rock and had terrible mana screws/bad luck so he built two color deck - white was better option than green.

If you can't get rid of a card just put it out and don't think about it. I wouldn't play Bone Shredder - it is bad here, and I wouldn't play Bane of the Living cause it is even worse (kills your own creatures). Instead of Kokusho that sucks without Survival I would play Spiritmonger or even Iwamori - it is a little bit risky though. Solemn shouldn't be in two color deck with green (my brother doesn't play it in his WB version cause it is not good enough).