Hello everybody! I finally decided to join these forums after I saw that Nastaboi and bunch of other Finns did that too.
I think Goblins is probably one of the best decks in this format. It can fight with all 3-5 color control decks with speed, disruption and blood moon effects and other aggro decks with the crazy card advantage it generates via Bidding and Living Death for example.
I've been tuning this deck for over a year and the current build is:
LANDS, MANA and STUFF: (39):
1 Chrome Mox
1 Aether Vial
12 Mountain
5 Swamp
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Polluted Delta
1 Badlands
1 Blood Crypt
1 Sulfurous Springs
1 Auntie's Hovel
1 Graven Cairns
1 Shadowblood Ridge
1 City of Brass
1 Reflecting Pool
1 Ancient Tomb
1 Wasteland
1 Pendelhaven
1 BarbarÃan Ring
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Ghitu Encampment
1 City of Traitors
1 Mutavault
1 Urborg, Tomb or Yawgmoth
|
GOBLINS (33):
1 Goblin Lackey
1 Skirk Prospector
1 Goblin Sledder
1 Goblin Cadets
1 Frenzied Goblin
1 Mogg Fanatic
1 Mogg Raider
1 Knucklebone Witch
1 Tattermunge Maniac
1 Goblin Recruiter
1 Goblin Piledriver
1 Sparksmith
1 Mogg Flunkies
1 Squeaking Pie Sneak
1 Frogtosser Banneret
1 Weirding Shaman
1 Mogg War Marshal
1 Vexing Shusher
1 Goblin Warchief
1 Gempalm Incinerator
1 Goblin Matron
1 Mad Auntie
1 Goblin King
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Boggart Harbinger
1 Auntie’s Snitch
1 Taurean Mauler
1 Zo-Zu the Punisher
1 Goblin Ringleader
1 Wort, Boggart Auntie
1 Murderous Redcap
1 Siege-Gang Commander
1 Earwig Squad
|
OTHER DUDES(8 ):
1 Dark Confidant
1 Magus of the Moon
1 Imperial Recruiter
1 Duergar Hedge-Mage
1 Moggcatcher
1 Marsh Flitter
1 Flametongue Kavu
1 Shriekmaw
SPELLS(20):
1 Duress
1 Thoughtseize
1 Cursed Scroll
1 Nameless Inversion
1 Bitterblossom
1 Terminate
1 Night’s Whisper
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Price of Progress
1 Pillage
1 Dralnu’s Crusade
1 Phyrexian Arena
1 Tangle Wire
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Blood Moon
1 Ruination
1 Fodder Launch
1 Living Death
1 Patriarch’s Bidding
1 Profane Command
|
At the moment I'm testing Dragon Fodder and Goblin Deathraiders in place of Squeaking Pie Sneak and Weirding Shaman. There are still some cards I would like to get rid of but haven't come up with anything better (mostly Knucklebone Witch and Nameless Inversion).
I don't know if Goblins have had any success at GP:s but it would surely be competent.
If I have time I'll add some tournament results later after I have translated them.
Feel free to comment and ask if you have any questions about card choices.
EDIT: Added mws-file!
The Deck looks quite solid and I can imagine how strong it could be.
Goblins were not realy presented at the last Grand Prixs, but a few years ago, RDW was one of the strongest decks in the format, and af far as I know, there was even a discussion about banning Goblin Lackey.
Maybe you could send me your List as a MWS data, if you have got one. I would willingly test your deck.
You could also join the ligue, to show how your deck can perform.
I like BR very much too but i totally ignore the gobblin theme. Would be nice if we can play some "mirror" matches to see how the different styles work.
Here's the actual macth-up-breakdown of my BR:
12:10 5cc Control (most of them vs Mythrandir)
4:1 RG-Beatz (Georg B)
6:4 Skies
3:2 Elves!
1:2 UW-Control
2:1 Captain America
and some more...
altogether 34:23 (59,65%, 3rd place in my ranking)
btw: Our league is a quite good opportunity for testing your deck on a high play-level. You are still able to join our running season without any drawbacks. Next pairings will be available thursday/friday.
havent i played against a RG goblins somewhere?! VAzdru was it you?
i thought it was kind of slowish as compared to RDW, but demonic tutor -> PoP, is always good :P
Quote from: Mythhavent i played against a RG goblins somewhere?! VAzdru was it you?
You didn't like (http://www.magicplayer.org/forum/index.php?topic=99.msg892#msg892) my Magus's.
I was using so_not's ropecon winning version (http://vaihdetaan.kapsi.fi/forums/index.php?topic=49289.msg200958#msg200958) of that same BRGoblin. To add injury to insult: I chose the deck purely on metapredicting basis as had learned you were likely to pilot the 5C yet again. :\
Quote from: pyyhttu on 08-10-2008, 09:10:50 PM
Quote from: Mythhavent i played against a RG goblins somewhere?! VAzdru was it you?
You didn't like (http://www.magicplayer.org/forum/index.php?topic=99.msg892#msg892) my Magus's.
I was using so_not's ropecon winning version (http://vaihdetaan.kapsi.fi/forums/index.php?topic=49289.msg200958#msg200958) of that same BRGoblin. To add injury to insult: I chose the deck purely on metapredicting basis as had learned you were likely to pilot the 5C yet again. :\
i´m not saying it aint good. i´m saying when i played against it (also non-league games), it seemed slowish compared to RDW, RDW also uses magus so dont see the point...
BTW, metapredicting?! c´mon! i always run 5CC... there isnt much to predict, is it?! :P
I added mws-file to the original to first post.
I agree that goblins might be a bit slower than some of the RDW:s but I don't actually see the point of playing RDW when you can play goblins :)
RDW doesn't have very good late game draws but goblins do. Black gives you card advatage in form of Dark Confidant, Bitterblossom, Bidding, Living Death, Profane Command, Shriekmaw and so on.
Black also gives more tutors for Goblin Recruiter. If some card from this deck was banned, it should be Recruiter not Lackey.
In the last two tournaments my matchups were:
ROPECON:
1: UW-Rebels 2-1 (lost one game to island sanctuary)
2: UGW-control 2-0 (not very interesting, Magus and Recruiter were enough)
3: MonoU-fish 2-0 (Sparsmith is good against fish, I even managed to win a game where he had both swords and vedalken shackles in play))
4: UB-control 2-1 (Lost one game to Damnation + Masticore)
5: UG-tron 2-1 (He is my teammate so we split the prices but played for fun. Nonbasiclandhate worked)
Other tournament a few weeks ago:
1: UWB-control 2-1 (lost one game to crovax + magus of the tabernacle)
2: GR-aggro 2-0 (Bitterblossom, Moggcatcher, Bidding + others made this easy)
3: UGr-aggrocontrol 2-0 (cool deck but manascrewed in first game and I drew enough removal in second)
4: UGB-control 2-1 (Pernicious deed + damnation got me in first game. Second I won without red mana by Vialing an Imperial Recruiter and fetching Magus of the Moon with it to get mountains. Third game mana screw for him)
5: UGRW-wildfirecontrol 2-1 (Wildfire + Wrath killed me in first game, wastelanded his tempo enough in second and Goblin Recruiter won the third)
6: Larkcombo: we drew because he was in a hurry.
Quote from: so_not on 09-10-2008, 10:13:44 AM
RDW doesn't have very good late game draws but goblins do. Black gives you card advatage in form of Dark Confidant, Bitterblossom, Bidding, Living Death, Profane Command, Shriekmaw and so on.
Black also gives more tutors for Goblin Recruiter. If some card from this deck was banned, it should be Recruiter not Lackey.
Totally aggree, but also gives more time to your oponnent ;) but tghe fact that you play disruption also helps.
2nd turn bitterblossom is really though. :P
So after almost two years I took goblins out for spin and again didn't lose any matches.
Here is the current decklist:
(http://i10.aijaa.com/t/00621/6181280.t.jpg) (http://www.aijaa.com/v.php?i=6181280.jpg)
Chrome Mox
AEther Vial
Veinfire Borderpost
9 Mountain
3 Swamp
Wooded Foothills
Bloodstained Mire
Polluted Delta
Arid Mesa
Scalding Tarn
Marsh Flats
Verdant Catacombs
Badlands
Blood Crypt
Sulfurous Springs
Auntie's Hovel
Dragonskull Summit
Lavaclaw Reaches
Graven Cairns
Pendelhaven
BarbarÃan Ring
Volrath's Stronghold
Ghitu Encampment
Mutavault
Dust Bowl
Wasteland
Urborg, Tomb or Yawgmoth
|
Goblin Lackey
Skirk Prospector
Frenzied Goblin
Tattermunge Maniac
Goblin Guide
Goblin Bushwacker
Goblin Recruiter
Goblin Piledriver
Sparksmith
Mogg War Marshal
Vexing Shusher
Dragon Fodder
Goblin Tinkerer
Jund Hackblade
Warren Instigator
Goblin Deathraiders
Slavering Nulls
Goblin Warchief
Gempalm Incinerator
Goblin Matron
Mad Auntie
Goblin King
Goblin Sharpshooter
Boggart Harbinger
Auntie’s Snitch
Taurean Mauler
Zo-Zu the Punisher
Boggart Ram-Gang
Goblin Ruinblaster
Goblin Chieftain
Goblin Ringleader
Wort, Boggart Auntie
Murderous Redcap
Tuk Tuk Scrapper
Marsh Flitter
Goblin Razerunners
Siege-Gang Commander
Earwig Squad
|
Figure of Destiny
Dark Confidant
Magus of the Moon
Imperial Recruiter
Moggcatcher
Flametongue Kavu
Shriekmaw
Lightning Bolt
Sensei's Divining Top
Cursed Scroll
Bitterblossom
Magma Jet
Searing Blaze
Char
Dralnu’s Crusade
Phyrexian Arena
Profane Command
Price of Progress
Blood Moon
Tangle Wire
Sword of Fire and Ice
Demonic Tutor
Living Death
Patriarch’s Bidding
Flame Javelin
|
I played this in two smaller tournaments, three rounds both:
monoR burn (2-1 this is a total coin flip)
GW midrange (2-1 against Sephiron. This should favor goblins since recruiter=gg but I managed to lose a game to manascrew)
4C-LD control (2-1 lost one game again to manascrew)
4C-control (2-1 yeah...mana screw)
URgb Wildfire Swans (2-0 first game fast beats+blood moon, second he had only islands)
GR aggro (2-1 favors goblins, mana flood got me in the second game)
I would still pick this any time over mono red versions.
friend of mine play goblins for like 8 years now he had everything mono r singleton mono r 100 card and rb of course rb seems to be strongest build for us too... i like your build almost identical with friends goblins but i might suggest you goblin grenade and fireblast
Quote from: majko53 on 14-05-2010, 12:36:06 PM
friend of mine play goblins for like 8 years now he had everything mono r singleton mono r 100 card and rb of course rb seems to be strongest build for us too... i like your build almost identical with friends goblins but i might suggest you goblin grenade and fireblast
Yeah I actually cut Grenade in the very early development since it just doesn't support your game plan. You don't want to keep it in your opening hand since it is quite bad during the first turns. There are also a lot of situations when you don't want to draw it later either.
Fireblast is also bad during the first turns. This deck can operate with 3 lands but it will need the 4th and 5th land in the late game so you only want fireblast when opponent is at 4 or you can clear the way for the kill with it.
I'd guess an even more aggressive mono red version would want them but I wouldn't really know what to cut in favor of those in this version.
Looks very solid. Only cards I find questionable are Flame Javelin and Char. Especially the latter feels so awkward when compared to Incinerate. Javelin also seems worse than Burst Lightning, Firebolt or Chain Lightning. Does the deck need to have that extra point of damage so bad it can afford to pay extra mana?
I have been trying all sorts of burn packages and currently it looks like this. The 1 extra damage makes all the difference sometimes in this deck, since most of time burn are used either as finisher or late game removal. There are some really stupid 4 toughness creatures like Thoctar, Hierarch and Teferi for example.
I don't like Chain Lightning very much and I haven't actually tried Burst lightning but and I will as soon as I get a foil one :)
Hey,
I wanted some funny "aggro" Deck and also one with some nonbasic land hate and I came around this deck ... I got a main question:
What is Tuk Tuk Scrapper in there for? I mean is 4 mana for a artifact destruction worth it?
and some another questions.. do you got an up to date liste?! ... Did you try around with some burn? Is Goblin Razerunners good because I had mostly the feeling you wanna keep your mana :-/ ?
thx 4 all answers!
Scrapper is something that was missing before (effective easily tutorable artifact removal). Goblin Tinkerer and Goblin Vandal are both pretty pathetic and they don't really deal with Vedalken Shackles and Sword of Fire and Ice that are your main artifact enemies.
From the above list I have cut at least:
Goblin Tinkerer
Goblin Sharpshooter
Goblin Razerunners
Cursed Scroll
Bitterblossom
Char
Profane Command
Flame Javelin
Dust Bowl
+something else and probably manabase is a bit different too?
Instead I have at least:
Hymn to Tourach
Duress
Thoughtseize
Recurring Nightmare
Necropotence
Ember Hauler
Burst Lightning
Grim Lavamancer
Terminate
Incinerate
Mishra's Factory
Some of the changes are made purely based on the metagame and some cards are still in testing.
first of all: thank you for this great deck list. i used it to build my version of the deck, which i play in the current hll-season (season ten).
// Lands
1 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (4)
1 [FUT] Graven Cairns
1 [SH] Volrath's Stronghold
1 [MOR] Mutavault
1 [WWK] Lavaclaw Reaches
1 [TE] Wasteland
1 [LRW] Auntie's Hovel
10 [ZEN] Mountain (1)
3 [ZEN] Swamp (3a)
1 [ON] Goblin Burrows
1 [ON] Wooded Foothills
1 [10E] Sulfurous Springs
1 [M10] Dragonskull Summit
1 [DIS] Blood Crypt
1 Badlands
1 [ZEN] Marsh Flats
1 [ZEN] Verdant Catacombs
1 [ON] Polluted Delta
1 [ZEN] Scalding Tarn
1 [ON] Bloodstained Mire
1 [ZEN] Arid Mesa
1 [PLC] Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
// Creatures
1 [NE] Moggcatcher
1 [LE] Goblin Grappler
1 [EVG] Mogg Fanatic
1 [LRW] Shriekmaw
1 [FNM] Flametongue Kavu
1 [MOR] Frogtosser Banneret
1 [FUT] Magus of the Moon
1 [RAV] Dark Confidant
1 [MOR] Earwig Squad
1 [M10] Siege-Gang Commander
1 [LRW] Wort, Boggart Auntie
1 [AP] Goblin Ringleader
1 [M10] Goblin Chieftain
1 [MR] Spikeshot Goblin
1 [CHK] Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1 [SHM] Murderous Redcap
1 [LRW] Boggart Mob
1 [SC] Goblin Warchief
1 [MOR] Weirding Shaman
1 [US] Goblin Lackey
1 [VI] Goblin Recruiter
1 [SHM] Vexing Shusher
1 [TSP] Mogg War Marshal
1 [ON] Goblin Piledriver
1 [ZEN] Goblin Bushwhacker
1 [ZEN] Goblin Guide
1 [SHM] Tattermunge Maniac
1 [RAV] Frenzied Goblin
1 [ON] Skirk Prospector
1 [WWK] Slavering Nulls
1 [ZEN] Goblin Ruinblaster
1 [ON] Goblin Sharpshooter
1 [CHK] Zo-Zu the Punisher
1 [MOR] Auntie's Snitch
1 [LRW] Boggart Harbinger
1 [ALA] Goblin Deathraiders
1 [10E] Goblin King
1 [LRW] Mad Auntie
1 [US] Goblin Matron
1 [LE] Gempalm Incinerator
1 [ZEN] Warren Instigator
1 [US] Goblin Patrol
1 [DIS] Rakdos Guildmage
1 [TO] Grim Lavamancer
1 [WWK] Tuktuk Scrapper
// Spells
1 [ON] Patriarch's Bidding
1 [DS] Sword of Light and Shadow
1 [LRW] Tarfire
1 Demonic Tutor
1 [MOR] Warren Weirding
1 [OD] Reckless Charge
1 [LG] Chain Lightning
1 [DS] AEther Vial
1 [ALA] Dragon Fodder
1 [M10] Lightning Bolt
1 [MOR] Bitterblossom
1 [FD] Magma Jet
1 [DS] Sword of Fire and Ice
1 [PS] Dralnu's Crusade
1 [AP] Phyrexian Arena
1 [CH] Blood Moon
1 [IA] Incinerate
1 [RAV] Char
1 [SC] Sulfuric Vortex
1 [TSP] Sudden Shock
1 [MR] Chrome Mox
1 [AL] Pillage
i too found out, that you need some sort of artifact hate and that tinekerer is too slow. for this reason i added pillage, which can also kill the problematic lands( maze and tabernacle)
Here is an updated list which did 5-0 a while ago. Besieged offers Goblin Wardriver that will probably replace Taurean Mauler or Ruinblaster.
Goblin Lackey
Skirk Prospector
Frenzied Goblin
Tattermunge Maniac
Goblin Guide
Spikeshot Elder
Goblin Recruiter
Goblin Piledriver
Sparksmith
Mogg War Marshal
Vexing Shusher
Dragon Fodder
Warren Instigator
Goblin Deathraiders
Slavering Nulls
Ember Hauler
Goblin Warchief
Gempalm Incinerator
Goblin Matron
Mad Auntie
Goblin King
Boggart Harbinger
Auntie's Snitch
Taurean Mauler
Zo-Zu the Punisher
Boggart Ram-Gang
Goblin Ruinblaster
Goblin Chieftain
Goblin Ringleader
Wort, Boggart Auntie
Murderous Redcap
Tuk Tuk Scrapper
Marsh Flitter
Siege-Gang Commander
Earwig Squad
Figure of Destiny
Grim Lavamancer
Dark Confidant
Kargan Dragonlord
Magus of the Moon
Imperial Recruiter
Moggcatcher
Flametongue Kavu
Molten-Tail Masticore
Shriekmaw
Arc-Slogger
Thoughseize
Duress
Inquisition of Kozilek
Lightning Bolt
Magma Jet
Searing Blaze
Price of Progress
Demonic Tutor
hymn to Tourach
Terminate
Dralnu's Crusade
Blood Moon
Tangle Wire
Sword of Fire and Ice
Koth of the Hammer
Living Death
Patriarch's Bidding
Chrome Mox
AEther Vial
9 Mountain
3 Swamp
Wooded Foothills
Bloodstained Mire
Polluted Delta
Arid Mesa
Scalding Tarn
Marsh Flats
Verdant Catacombs
Badlands
Blood Crypt
Sulfurous Springs
Auntie's Hovel
Dragonskull Summit
Lavaclaw Reaches
Graven Cairns
Blackcleave Cliffs
Pendelhaven
Barbarían Ring
Mishra's Factory
Ghitu Encampment
Mutavault
Rishadan Port
Wasteland
Urborg, Tomb or Yawgmoth
Cedzoh: While Pillage is decent it can't be tutored with goblin tutors or Imperial Recruiter.
I like this decklist. But I still got a few questions:
In which meta did you reached 5-0, against which decks where you playing?
How good are: Chrome Mox (I can't imagine that the drawback is worth the acceleration)
Dralnu's Crusade (Like Glorius Anthem but not for all of your creatures)
Tuktuk Scrapper (Tutorable but 2/2 for 4 Mana and only 1 damage to opponent)
Marsh Flitter (4 Mana 3 times 1/1 which grows to 3/3 like a Phantom Monster, i really don't know what to think about this one)
I think Taurean Mauler and Goblin Ruinblaster are one of the best Goblins ever printed(especially T.Mauler), why don't you cut Vexing Shusher for Goblin Wardriver?(or is he is so important)
What do you think of Goblin Bushwacker, Arc-Trail, Warren Weirding, Blightning and Boartusk Liege?
My matchups were burn 2-0, ur tempo 2-0, ub control 2-0, gb rock 1-0-1 and ubw control 2-0.
Chrome Mox gets mulliganed on the play a lot but it is just so good on the draw stealing the tempo.
Dralnu's Crusade is decent. Nothing spectacular but it's mainly there because of Spikeshot Elder. The deck is living all the time so next time I might play it or not. There are actually quite a lot of cards that gets in and out all the time because I can't decide if they are better or worse than some other cards. I should lose some matches first to make those decisions :)
Taurean Mauler and Ruinblaster were my victims last time. They aren't bad but Mauler doesn't do much other than is an occasional 5/5. All the other 3 drops are generally better or serve some meaningful business. Ruinblaster costs 4 and since I add 2 other 4 drops, it just had to go for now. I've always liked Marsh Flitter since it generates card advantage and there are so many bosses in the deck that the tokens are often more than 1/1s. But anyway Flitter is also one of those cards that you could play or not, I totally accept Ruinblaster in it's place. This deck is just so good against control that you don't really need another control hoser. Aggros are harder and Flitter is better against them.
Scrapper is a must. You have lots of goblin tutors and Scrapper is the best tutorable artifact removal. The 4 cost is irrelevant.
I tried Bushwacker but it was pretty lame. It doesn't help in anything this deck tries to achieve.
Warren Weirding was cut in the very early development but it was so long time ago that I can't really remember why. I would guess that you don't lose many games because of not having it in your deck. There are multiple other goblin-removals (Sparksmith, Spikeshot, Gempalm Incinerator, Siege Gang, Murderous Redcap, Ember Hauler) so usually one of those does the job in the case you have to tutor for removal. And if you draw it, it is just a bad edict.
I have been thinking of Arc-Trail but at the moment there are no room. I think the other burn spells in the deck are better, but I'll have to test Arc Trail some more. There are just so few tournaments and so many cool decks I need to play in this format that testing new cards properly is hard :D .
I don't really like Blightning. It costs 3 which is quite much and you can't really fit it in your curve since turn 3 you should definitely be playing a creature and Blightning is anyway bad turn 3. That means you have wait to play a card that doesn't affect board position or disrupt your opponents curve/gameplan.
Liege is in the deck at the moment but it is another card that is hard to evaluate.
Quote from: so_not on 31-01-2011, 06:28:04 PM
There are actually quite a lot of cards that gets in and out all the time because I can't decide if they are better or worse than some other cards.
Can you write down which cards you mean. Which cards are good enough to be in this deck?
Quote from: GoblinPiledriver on 01-02-2011, 04:51:21 PM
Quote from: so_not on 31-01-2011, 06:28:04 PM
There are actually quite a lot of cards that gets in and out all the time because I can't decide if they are better or worse than some other cards.
Can you write down which cards you mean. Which cards are good enough to be in this deck?
I don't have that kind of list and I think the current list is pretty close what the deck should look like but sometimes I want more CA (Arena, Necropotence (Top)), removal(like Profane Command), disruption (Dust Bowl, Winter Orb, Ruination) or just different goblins to fix my curve after other changes (Mogg Flunkies, Goblin Cadets and Goblin General for example).
I did play legacy goblins a lot. I'm wondering if you tested frogtosser banneret? It is amazing acceleration for your onslaught :)
Did you try Sensation Gorger? Seems like pretty solid card draw for me (maybe instead of bob).
Quote from: SpoCk0nd0pe on 21-04-2011, 03:00:04 AM
I did play legacy goblins a lot. I'm wondering if you tested frogtosser banneret? It is amazing acceleration for your onslaught :)
Did you try Sensation Gorger? Seems like pretty solid card draw for me (maybe instead of bob).
Banneret was in the original build (first post) but got cut somewhere along the way because it's so small and the acceleration was not very relevant somehow. Even Warchief is not great (although pretty good) on it's own but it's very needed in most of Recruiter-kills. Banneret is good if you play with the Kiki-Jiki/Lightning Crafter/Skirk Prospector-combo which is fine if something like Moat feels unwinnable otherwise.
Sensation Gorger is not very good because it also gives cards to your opponent and there are only about 40 goblins (or less) in the deck.
Hi, i am building RB goblin deck right now and would welcome some advice about gameplay.
1) Can anybody advice me some strong Goblin Recruiter chains on turn 2? What are the possibilities and disadvantages.
2) What do you think about Kiki-Jiki and Phyrexian Metamorph?
3) What kind of matchup is GBW hulk-pattern combo? What card choices helps here (some gy hate tutorable by goblins tutors?)
Thanks
Quote from: Han on 30-01-2012, 03:34:17 PM
Hi, i am building RB goblin deck right now and would welcome some advice about gameplay.
1) Can anybody advice me some strong Goblin Recruiter chains on turn 2? What are the possibilities and disadvantages.
2) What do you think about Kiki-Jiki and Phyrexian Metamorph?
3) What kind of matchup is GBW hulk-pattern combo? What card choices helps here (some gy hate tutorable by goblins tutors?)
Thanks
1) It's always a bit risky to cast Recruiter on second turn but usually I search something like:
Warchief
Ringleader
Skirk Prospector
Mogg War Marshal
-after this it's much more situation and matchup dependent but most of the time you should go along the lines of:-
Goblin Piledriver
Goblin Incinerator
Goblin Chieftain, Mad Auntie or King
-this would be the first wave. Second wave could include something like:-
Siege Gang Commander
more Kings
Murderous Redcap
Wort
and so on...
Make sure you have access to at least 4 lands when doing this. Best second turn Recruiters are obviously supported by first turn discard to see if coast is clear.
2) Kiki-Jiki enables a tutorable combo kill but isn't very useful otherwise. Metamorph doesn't seem very good but then again I haven't tried it. Splashing Birthing Pod should increase the value of Metamorph.
3) Killing manadudes and landing Magus/Blood Moon seems like a good start. Discard is golden and Hulk is most of the time a bit clunky so fast starts+well timed removal might do the trick. If you have Pattern-Hulk in your meta and it poses an actual threat then you just might want to try combo them out faster (at least if they land an Academy Rector).
Quote from: so_not on 31-01-2012, 07:04:08 PM
Quote from: Han on 30-01-2012, 03:34:17 PM
Hi, i am building RB goblin deck right now and would welcome some advice about gameplay.
1) Can anybody advice me some strong Goblin Recruiter chains on turn 2? What are the possibilities and disadvantages.
2) What do you think about Kiki-Jiki and Phyrexian Metamorph?
3) What kind of matchup is GBW hulk-pattern combo? What card choices helps here (some gy hate tutorable by goblins tutors?)
Thanks
1) It's always a bit risky to cast Recruiter on second turn but usually I search something like:
Warchief
Ringleader
Skirk Prospector
Mogg War Marshal
-after this it's much more situation and matchup dependent but most of the time you should go along the lines of:-
Goblin Piledriver
Goblin Incinerator
Goblin Chieftain, Mad Auntie or King
-this would be the first wave. Second wave could include something like:-
Siege Gang Commander
more Kings
Murderous Redcap
Wort
and so on...
Make sure you have access to at least 4 lands when doing this. Best second turn Recruiters are obviously supported by first turn discard to see if coast is clear.
2) Kiki-Jiki enables a tutorable combo kill but isn't very useful otherwise. Metamorph doesn't seem very good but then again I haven't tried it. Splashing Birthing Pod should increase the value of Metamorph.
3) Killing manadudes and landing Magus/Blood Moon seems like a good start. Discard is golden and Hulk is most of the time a bit clunky so fast starts+well timed removal might do the trick. If you have Pattern-Hulk in your meta and it poses an actual threat then you just might want to try combo them out faster (at least if they land an Academy Rector).
Thanks a lot for answers. My meta is quite different, because we are playing with players having 25 life at the beginning of the match. So its less aggroish.
There for I play Ruinblasters for example. I will post my list after some more testing.
Phyrexian metamorph is answer for some Natural order shenegains like Progenitus or also Thrun. It also can copy goblin with CIP effects. Truth being he is not goblin. So its tutorable only be Demonic Tutor (i dont have Imperial Recruiter).
I quite like cards not in your list:
Hero of Oxid Ridge
Reccuring Nightmare
And i am not sure about these cards (testing them right now):
Stingscourger - nice answer, reanimator in my meta as well
Clickslither - seems nice
Goblin Pyromancer - nice with sac outlet, and Moggcatcher trick
What do you think of them. And why dont you play Goblin Sharpshooter anymore? I have also thinking about green splash (tin street hooligan and maybe Food Chain of Fecundity), but i think that Moons are more important in the list. Thanks for more responses.
I haven't played the deck since the last list I posted and the format/metagame has changed so much I'll have to reconsider pretty much everything if I put the deck back together. I also make all these evaluations based on 20-life format, I really have no clue how 5 extra lives would affect the format as a whole (other than aggro being obviously worse).
Metamorph seems decent if your meta includes multiple Thruns/Progeniti.
Recurring Nightmare was always a bit too slow or just not needed. Living Death and Bidding should be sufficient mass recursion.
I didn't like Hero when I first saw it but it's been so good in standard that it's probably good enough for this deck too.
I accept Stingscourger as a metachoice but Clickslither and Pyromancer just don't do enough and there are already quite a few 4 drops.
Sharpshooter wasn't really needed in my meta back then. I'm not sure if I would play it even now but at least some people actually play creatures around here nowadays.
Splashing green is something I have considered also every now and then. There are plenty of ways to do this. You could just splash Tin Street Hooligan and Birthing Pod or go more deep with green and add something like: Maelstrom Pulse, Bloodbraid Elf, Worldly Tutor, Tarmogoyf, Vithian Renegades and maybe Lead the Stampede.
After some serious testing, this is a list i am quite satisfied with. Have on mind, that in my meta we play 25 lifes and, it is quite artifact heavy. This weekend we have tournament, so I will report you my results. If you have any comments or ideas, i would be glad to hear them.
// Lands
1 [IA] Sulfurous Springs
1 [WWK] Lavaclaw Reaches
1 [CHP] Mutavault
1 [TE] Wasteland
1 [SOM] Blackcleave Cliffs
1 [M11] Dragonskull Summit
1 [SHM] Graven Cairns
1 [ON] Wooded Foothills
1 [ON] Bloodstained Mire
1 [ON] Polluted Delta
1 [ZEN] Arid Mesa
1 [ZEN] Scalding Tarn
1 [OD] Barbarian Ring
1 Badlands
1 [DIS] Blood Crypt
1 [CH] City of Brass
1 [MM] Rishadan Port
2 [CHK] Swamp (2)
1 [R] Bayou
8 [AT] Mountain (2)
1 Taiga
1 [ZEN] Verdant Catacombs
1 [UL] Ghitu Encampment
1 [ZEN] Marsh Flats
1 [LRW] Auntie's Hovel
1 [WWK] Bojuka Bog
// Creatures
1cc
1 [EVE] Figure of Destiny
1 [US] Goblin Lackey
1 [TO] Grim Lavamancer
1 [RAV] Frenzied Goblin
1 [ZEN] Goblin Guide
1 [ON] Skirk Prospector
1 [SHM] Tattermunge Maniac
1 [SOM] Spikeshot Elder
2cc
1 [WWK] Slavering Nulls
1 [GP] Tin Street Hooligan
1 [ALA] Goblin Deathraiders
1 [RAV] Dark Confidant
1 [ON] Sparksmith
1 [TSP] Mogg War Marshal
1 [6E] Goblin Recruiter
1 [ON] Goblin Piledriver
1 [ZEN] Warren Instigator
1 [M11] Ember Hauler
1 [MBS] Goblin Wardriver
1 [ALA] Dragon Fodder
3cc
1 [SHM] Boggart Ram-Gang
1 [EVG] Goblin Matron
1 [M10] Goblin Chieftain
1 [SC] Goblin Warchief
1 [JUN] Mad Auntie
1 Goblin King
1 [ON] Goblin Sharpshooter
1 [FUT] Magus of the Moon
1 [LE] Gempalm Incinerator
1 [CHK] Zo-Zu the Punisher
1 [NPH] Phyrexian Metamorph
1 [LRW] Boggart Harbinger
4cc
1 [MBS] Hero of Oxid Ridge
1 [SHM] Murderous Redcap
1 [ZEN] Goblin Ruinblaster
1 [NE] Moggcatcher
1 [WWK] Tuktuk Scrapper
1 [LRW] Wort, Boggart Auntie
1 [AP] Goblin Ringleader
5cc
1 [MOR] Earwig Squad
1 [LRW] Shriekmaw
1 [FNM] Flametongue Kavu
1 [SC] Siege-Gang Commander
// Spells
discard
1 [FE] Hymn to Tourach (4)
1 [LRW] Thoughtseize
1 [M11] Duress
1 [ROE] Inquisition of Kozilek
1 [ALA] Blightning
removal
1 [WWK] Searing Blaze
1 [PS] Terminate
1 Lightning Bolt
1 [FD] Magma Jet
1 [SOM] Arc Trail
1 [MOR] Warren Weirding
1 [US] Arc Lightning
1 [MBS] Go for the Throat
1 [NPH] Dismember
other
1 [TE] Living Death
1 [ON] Patriarch's Bidding
1 [DS] AEther Vial
1 [R] Demonic Tutor
1 [DK] Blood Moon
1 [EX] Price of Progress
1 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
1 [AP] Phyrexian Arena
1 [DS] Sword of Fire and Ice
1 [TSP] Ancient Grudge
Quote from: so_not on 24-04-2011, 07:16:07 PM
Quote from: SpoCk0nd0pe on 21-04-2011, 03:00:04 AM
I did play legacy goblins a lot. I'm wondering if you tested frogtosser banneret? It is amazing acceleration for your onslaught :)
Did you try Sensation Gorger? Seems like pretty solid card draw for me (maybe instead of bob).
Banneret was in the original build (first post) but got cut somewhere along the way because it's so small and the acceleration was not very relevant somehow. Even Warchief is not great (although pretty good) on it's own but it's very needed in most of Recruiter-kills. Banneret is good if you play with the Kiki-Jiki/Lightning Crafter/Skirk Prospector-combo which is fine if something like Moat feels unwinnable otherwise.
Sensation Gorger is not very good because it also gives cards to your opponent and there are only about 40 goblins (or less) in the deck.
In my deck tryouts I usually hat the feeling my goblins lacked tempo. Compared to my legacy goblins (playing 2 chrome mox for turn 1 instigator) highlander goblins cannot keep up. But the banneret helps for sure.
@Han: I would also play tectonic edge, maybe dustbowl. Landdestruction proved critical to legacy goblins, I think this is true for highlander goblins as well. That's why I wouldn't cut the ruinblaster.
Maybe pillage>ancient grudge? It's less situational.
I do not like blightning, it just comes too late for relevant discard, and the combined damage effect just isn't worth it imho.
Goblin sledder is nothing to sneeze at for the final blow. Good card for the 1cc slot imho.
Chain lightning is another pretty good removal spell you might want to consider.
What about boggart mob and knucklebone witch? The witch is another decent 1cc drop.